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10/4/2006 What's up? I'm doing quite well, man. I'm trying to maintain. How did you get your start in hip-hop? It's been a lifelong thing. My first album I bought was Raising Hell in 1985 by Run-DMC. After I heard Rick Rubin on there I knew that I wanted to do something in the music industry. Then came The Great Adventures of Slick Rick and it was a wrap from there. How did you get your first engineering gig? In '96 I went to the Institute of Audio Research in New York City. I was never a school person. After two weeks I started knocking on doors and I got my first internship at Green Recording Studios. They did Public Enemy's Fear of a Black Planet, Pete Rock, Ice Cube's Amerikaz Most Wanted, Bell Biv Devoe, Whodini and a few others. From there I never looked back. My first official gig came in '98 when I worked at Daddy's House with Puff. I started getting paid and I was making somewhat of a living doing it. When I interviewed Southpaw he said that if you're not a Haitian at Bad Boy then they have no use for you. How do you feel about that statement? We both did different things over there. I was there at a different time. Things really evolved over there and I would never speak badly about them because we still have a great relationship. You're definitely dealing with a lot of egos over there. At the same time, Puff gave me a chance to do what I do. It's not a place to make a career out of but it's a place to get your credentials. It's not a bad thing having your name on all those Bad Boy records either. What project are you most proud of from your Bad Boy days? Definitely 8Ball and MJG's "Living Legends". They're very professional, very cool and very not-New York, if that makes sense. They would come to the studio, get whatever they needed to done and they'd be out. I'm really proud of all the work I was part of over there because I had a chance to work at least once with just about everyone. How was it mixing TI's "King Back"? I definitely have to thank my man Nastee. Nastee produced "Fuck Jay-Z" and "Backpack", for Jin. He has also mixed countless classic records. That came about from our relationship with Just Blaze. We used to all work together at The Cutting Room. We walked into the studio and there it was. That's the first song on the album. It was a lot of fun. The mix took about nineteen hours to do. Most people think mixing is a very easy process. I'm going to dismiss that. When you listen to the record now, it was worth it and you can hear all the work that was put into it. What's going on in those nineteen hours? There's a lot of tweaking and a lot of listening in different systems. We're going into the boombox and making sure the low-end is right. The bass has to be settling right. One of the things that we had an issue with was the bass in the sample. What ended up happening was that in the middle of the mix, Just pulled out a keyboard, sound module, and played the bass live into Pro Tools. You can't make things too bright or too bottomy. You have to make sure that when it goes into mastering that they have enough to work with. It was a big record. There was a lot of pressure on that one. Who approves your mixes? For example on this TI record, I think when you work with a guy like Just, I think he has more pull than others. I would have to say he would have to approve it. The label is basically a bunch of puppets anyway. Just would have more of a say on whether it's a go or not. Do a lot of your artists stay involved in the mixing process? This is a good time to mention Pen. Poison Pen is probably one of the better artists in that field. Pen understands the whole mixing and the whole mastering process of a record. A lot of artists allow me to do what I do just because of my background. They know that this is what I do. I have a couple artists who have studios and engineers themselves who record their own vocals. It takes years to be called an engineer. But when they record in their own studio, I think they get caught up in their own sound and they want to go towards that. They don't realize that when you're mixing, you're trying to achieve something for mastering and that when it's mastered, it comes out sounding properly. Sometimes there's a fight. Jin is very good. He allows me to do what I do, as does Pen and Ras Kass. Just allowed us to do what we do. The good artists allow you to do what you do. Some are so stuck on "their sound" that sometimes it becomes a struggle, but I usually win. (laughs) How was it working on Ras Kass's Eat or Die? I have to thank Pen for hooking that up. That was a major experience. Ras has worked with Dr. Dre, so knowing that, I obviously wanted to learn a lot about him in the studio. I know Ras will probably laugh when he reads this, but I know there were a couple of times when I questioned what he did. He would sometimes refer to what Dr. Dre does and how he waits a long time for records to come out. That was him telling me about how picky I could be. Working with him, he's very professional and he knows what he wants. He has made some incredible, classic records. Working with him was definitely one of the better experiences I've had in the studio. How's Jin in the studio? He's another great one. He's very young and he has years ahead of him. He's very open to what he wants and he's very receptive to taking input from me. I'm trying to help them do their best on the mic and Jin is very receptive to that. What are the differences you have to be aware of when you're recording Pen, Ras Kass or Jin? You always follow the same formula. I think Pen allows me to do more. He trusts me more. Ras Kass has mixed with some of the best mixers in the history of music and he's from LA. There are a lot of really good mixers out in LA. Ras can pinpoint certain things that he wants. Pen allows me to do what I do and Jin also allows me to do what I do. I think Jin is learning more and more about the mixing process as his time comes up. That's truly the difference between the three of them. It's all about what they've done and who they've worked with. What if an artist isn't satisfied with your mix? I guarantee my mixes. This is something that I always do. I also give them a window to make changes. I expect changes and I always encourage them to go to their home stereo where they're used to hearing mixes and want changes. Sometimes they're not used to my mixes. I tell them, I know how it's going to sound when you leave here, but you have to listen to see if you're satisfied with what's coming out. Usually it's minor changes. Sometimes they want to hear less reverb or louder vocals. I always accommodate them and we always end up getting it right. Do you hear a lot of songs on commercial radio that make you cringe? Absolutely. I think that nowadays the engineering game is completely different in the sense that a lot of the engineers coming out now are younger guys. They really don't understand. A lot of guys are learning Pro Tools at home. When I was coming up I came up through the ranks and the system. I watched others working extensively. It's like sitting with Just Blaze or Dr. Dre for five years watching them make beats. You're obviously going to pick things up that kids at home with an MPC aren't going to pick up. I get a lot of phone calls from kids asking me to teach them how to mix. I'm an advocate of interning. If you want to be an engineer, you have to go through the ranks. What label consistently has the best mixes? Aftermath. It's Dr. Dre. I think Dr. Dre's ear is impeccable. He hires good engineers and he understands and he really takes time to listen and perfect that sound. If you listen to every song he's put out, the sonic quality of it is incredible. What do you think of DJ Premier's mixes? You can't really comment on anything that's happened recently. I always admired Premier's mixes, and that's not to take away from any other producers. There are a lot of producers who understand how to bring out the sound. As soon as you heard the Premier track, you knew it was him. Obviously it was the production but it was also in the mixes. You would hear the crackling of the record. I admire whoever mixed his records. What do you think of the mix on Yung Joc's "It's Goin' Down"? I think it sounds good. I know whose ear it was because I trained under that person's ear for a long time. I also think a lot of people are doing things in Pro Tools now and one of the things I really miss now is the warmth in the songs. I think the Yung Joc is more on the bright side. I don't think it's a bad mix. I think it's one of the better mixes out right now. Puffy's got one of the greatest ears. The reason I wanted to work there and why I pursued getting a job there early on was because of the way the Bad Boy records sounded. From '98 to 2000, there was not a better sounding album out. He had the best engineers. Puffy might not be the guy tapping on the MPC but his ear is incredible and he knows what to pick out of a record. With all the Pro Tools and home studios, can the engineer eventually be phased out? I don't think so. I think it's going to come back full circle. There will always be a need for quality. A lot of records used to be mixed at The Hit Factory and now it's closed down. I read an article a few years ago where an engineer said the future is going to be engineers being able to adapt to any environment where he could go to a producer's house and do mixes. I think that's where the quality is going to be brought back. I think a lot of the producers now are tired of doing things themselves. In the future I think there's going to be more of hiring an engineer with a good ear to come into their house. What do you use on your mixes? I'm a big Pro Tools guy. When I was at Daddy's House and we were working on his album Forever, we were probably one of the first studios in the country to decide to go all Pro Tools. I've been using it since '97. How hard is it to get a good mix off Pro Tools? It's the ear. It has nothing to do with the Pro Tools. I tell people that I use the most simple tools in the Pro Tools program. It's all a program. That's all it is. Everybody uses an MPC, but what can you do with an MPC? Can you pull the same things out of it that Premo or Dre pull out of it? It all depends what you do with it. Can you do that? Can you take it there? Is having a good ear something that comes natural or do you have to work to get it? That's years and years of learning and working and watching others. I used to basically get the studio at night when the sessions were done and I would invite artists over. Looking back, you think you're doing a good mix, but now I can see that was the grunt work to get to where I'm at now where I can comfortably mix a record and know it comes out right. It's about understanding and knowing the mastering process. Mastering can make or break a record and it's the engineer's job to get the guy mastering it something good so he can do what he does. I also want to thank all the engineers I have had the privilege of working under that taught me all I know. I still study mixes. Do you do any mastering? I don't. I have my own mastering guy. His name is Kenny Dykstra. I send all of my mixes to him and he does what he does. I understand what goes into mastering but I'm an engineer and people in mastering highly respect what I do and I highly respect what they do. What's the difference between mixing and mastering? They basically take a good mix or a great mix and enhance it. Mastering gives the song an overall shine. They compress it for radio. It needs to be at certain levels for radio. Sometimes they say, How come it isn't as loud as a 50 Cent record or the TI mix? I always explain that that's the mastering. The mastering takes a five and turns it to a ten. You've also worked as a second engineer. What are the responsibilities of the second engineer? You need to make sure that the session runs smooth without the engineer having to think. Your only job is to make sure the engineer is only thinking about the song. If you have to retrace your steps on wiring or anything like that, it can really slow down the engineer and it can make everyone in the studio unhappy. You are on the client's clock. For an artist with a limited budget, is it better to get one song completely mixed and mastered or record a complete mixtape or album with lower sound quality? At the end of the day, labels know what sounds good and what doesn't. You have to remember that when you're bringing a product up to a label, these guys are bringing top engineers up there to mix. I've seen a lot of mixtapes with lower quality. A lot of reviews say that records may have been great but the vocals were too bright and it sounded like something was distorted. In this day and age, artists are doing a lot of things on their own, but if you can put some money aside to mix, that's really the most important thing. What are your goals as a producer? I think there are a lot of beat-makers out there and they like to jump the gun early. There is so much more in production than just making a beat. There's a rock band I've worked with that I've done two records with named Fn-Co. They're managed by my boy Don DiNapoli. When you do a rock record, it really gets your feet wet on a different level. Guys like Dr. Dre and Rick Rubin are on entirely different levels. That's where I want to get to. I make beats but I can play a guitar if I need to or if I need to bring in a bass player to recreate a sample, I can do that. I think I see myself going in that direction and I think the engineering aspect gave me the knowledge to do that. In the future I would also like to get more into A&R'ing. What's up with your artist, City? He's from Columbus, Ohio and I've been working with him for about four years. He's coming along well but I don't want to jump the gun with him. I want to make sure he gets the right tracks. DJ Static has been doing a lot with me on the project. He's done a lot of work with Pen and he did Jin's "Long Winding Road." I'm also working with Playboy Chi. You want to make sure your artist is writing original songs and not doing what everyone else is doing. We're basically perfecting what he's doing right now. Do you recommend audio schools for potential engineers? I could compare it to college. It gives you the book smarts about what to do and how to do it. What you do with it afterwards is what you make out of it. There are a lot of kids coming out of college expecting to make money. Everyone expects to make money right away and it's not like that. That's why I wanted the real-world experience first. I got that by interning. Education is a great groundwork to start you off and you learn a lot of things there, but I think the real-life experience will outweigh the school, always, and it may take a few years to understand that. What's your focus now? We're working on finishing up Pen's album. I'm going to be doing some stuff with City. There's a lot of things on the table right now. There's so many things to go through. I've had meetings with other producers about doing work with them. It's a seven day a week job. It doesn't end, man. Are you aware of your cult figure status as a result of the Poison Pen Journal? (laughs) No, I didn't even know. How did you react when Poison Pen fired you? I was upset and contemplating leaving the game altogether. Just kidding. Did you have a little celebration when you got rehired? Yes. We popped bottles and all that. What do you want to say to everybody? If you want to get into engineering, learn the craft. Get into the studio. Now that the game is changing, you might want to find an engineer with a home studio. Ask them to work. Don't always look for money. The money will come with hard work. Stick to your guns and keep your ears open and your mouth shut. That would be the best advice. Learn your craft and try to develop your own style. Definitely look out of Westward Productions. We'll be doing a lot of things in the next couple of years. If anyone is interested in mixing, definitely feel free to get at me. http://myspace.com/westwardproductions westwardproductions@gmail.com

By Brian Kayser

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